Carburetor Or Efi--which One Is Better With A Supercharger?

Discussion in 'Supercharger Articles' started by Vanessa Wilson, Apr 14, 2015.

By Vanessa Wilson on Apr 14, 2015 at 12:34 AM
  1. Vanessa Wilson

    carburator.jpg
    Driven by a constant need to promote healthier air and better fuel economy, the automotive industry has universally decided that fuel injection is the only option available. The last carbureted production cars were produced in 1990, and nothing we’ve heard from the industry indicates that they’ll ever come back.​

    But most fans of high-performance supercharged cars and trucks couldn’t care less about gas mileage. We appreciate cars not because they get us to work on Monday, but because they go fast. So when you decide to build a fast car, you might be faced with the decision to choose between fuel injection and carburetion. But which one is better for supercharging, and why?

    Carburetors are generally simpler in theory and operation than EFI systems, but they depend a great deal on atmospheric conditions. One example of this dependence is in the float bowl, where atmospheric pressure must be maintained for proper fuel flow. As the level of fuel changes, the atmospheric pressure in the bowl is maintained by special vent tubes, usually extending into the throat of the carburetor. Because the fuel in the bowl is at atmospheric pressure, it cannot flow into an area of higher pressure. So mounting a supercharger upstream of the carburetor defeats the entire system by eliminating vacuum. For this reason, mounting a supercharger on top of your existing carburetor would require encasing the entire carburetor in an airtight box, where boosted air pressure can replace atmospheric pressure.

    Of course, this is why many carbureted systems have the carb mounted before the supercharger, in what is called a draw-through system. While this solves the problems associated with atmospheric pressure, it still comes with at least 2 disadvantages. First, the lack of vacuum in a pressurized intake interferes with the proper operation of the carburetor power valve. Typical carbs, designed for use in N/A systems, can be modified to correct this by manifold referencing the power valves or plugging them entirely. Another option is to purchase a racing carb that has been specifically designed for use with forced induction engines, as these will come with manifold-referenced power valve(s).

    The other big problem with mounting a carb upstream of the supercharger is that the air/fuel mixture coming from the carb can be—and often is-- ignited by the heat of the supercharger.

    On the other hand, EFI systems don’t depend on atmospheric pressure to operate. The fuel is forced into the engine under pressure in a closed system independent of the atmosphere. This not only increases the stability of the fuel flow, it allows for electronic control over the air/fuel ratio under varying atmospheric conditions. With an EFI system, all of the engine’s operating parameters can be recorded, analyzed and improved upon even years after the readings were taken. EFI systems are also capable of compensating for varying conditions while the vehicle is operating. This is in direct contrast to a carburetor, which will require you to pull over for most adjustments, even minor ones.

    Nearly two decades after the mainstream automotive industry had moved past the carburetor, even NASCAR finally embraced fuel injection in 2012. A good portion of the pressure to make the change came from the automotive industry, who relies on racing experience for innovation, and who believes that consumers prefer seeing cars more like their own on the track. But even NASCAR admits that the change to EFI has resulted in fewer engine failures during a race, and racing teams have made the adjustment without any major problems. Master engine builder Doug Yates of Rousch-Yates embraced the change as well, calling the older carbureted systems “antiquated.”

    EFI offers a number of advantages over carburetion in a racing environment, including the ability to better adapt to changing track conditions.

    In a hard left turn, for example, when the centrifugal force tends to direct more of the fuel toward the right-hand side of the engine, the cylinders on the left-hand side of the engine receive less fuel. This means an increased chance of developing a dangerously lean condition. As a result, the fuel must be metered a bit on the rich side to avoid detonation. Furthermore, this rich mixture is used throughout the race and robs precious fuel economy.

    On the flip side, a multi-point fuel injection system delivers a separate fuel charge to each cylinder, and is thus immune to the effects of centrifugal force. The more precise delivery of fuel results in the ability to run a leaner mixture without fear of detonation and make fewer pit stops for fuel. If that isn’t enough, remember that the middle cylinders—numbers 3, 4, 5, and 6 in an 8-cylinder engine—don’t cool as well because they’re sandwiched in between the corner cylinders. Hotter cylinders require more fuel than cool ones, and fuel injection can compensate for the extra demand because each cylinder gets its own fuel supply. The single large injector in a TBI system does not have these advantages, however.

    Speaking of fuel supply, most carburetors will need to be modified to run anything higher than 5% ethanol. The current ethanol standard of 10% is already set to change as the ethanol industry—and the EPA-- is pushing for E15 and E20 gasoline, which contains enough alcohol to quickly turn a carburetor float into silly putty.

    There is still a very healthy interest in old-school hot rodding, where die-hard enthusiasts focus on a back-to-basics approach to the beloved pursuit of high-end performance. Cars built during the “golden age” of hot rodding benefit from ladder bars, Mickey Thompson 50’s and Holley Double-pumpers. In these cars, old-school carburetors are the only way to go. For the old school backyard hot rodder, there is something sickening and alien about hooking your ’49 Mercury Coupe to a laptop computer, and rightfully so: Being able to tune your engine to deliver mind-blowing performance using only your experience and feel for the motor is a fine art that suffers from technology rather than benefiting from it. This is the nature of art, and for many, hot rodding is an art.

    But for sheer performance and precision, you just can’t beat fuel injection. Old school carburetor enthusiasts who have spent a lifetime becoming an expert at carb tuning will probably want to argue the point, but the fact remains that technology is threatening to relegate all of that wonderful knowledge and skill to the realm of automotive trivia. Like solid rubber tires and hand-crank engines, the carburetor has been replaced with a system that simply works better and is more reliable on any car, supercharged or not.

    By Vanessa Wilson
     
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Comments

Discussion in 'Supercharger Articles' started by Vanessa Wilson, Apr 14, 2015.

    1. vinces427bb
      vinces427bb
      GM had fuel injected cars in the late fifties and early sixties, on several brands.
      it was mechanical and was not well received.

      it took the electronics of the early seventies to get fuel injection going again to bring us to here.
      it started with electronic ignition controls HEI, then included some crude sensors on carburetors...

      now there are several different versions of Fuel Injection systems available, some work with forced injection very well and others, not so much:blackalien:

      costs have come down slightly with more manufactures competing for the retrofit market, but still quite pricey for me...
    2. SCF/HAIC
      SCF/HAIC
      Old School Cool (even if it is fake!)

    3. vinces427bb
      vinces427bb
      not quite that easy ???:blackalien:
      I just watched one of those movies again:wideyed:
    4. bigblockragtop
      bigblockragtop
      So a C&S blow through carb is like solid rubber tires and hand cranks in comparison to efi. I get the whole efi deal but... My C&S carb is darn close to efi. I am only at 750+ hp. I would like to have efi but need deeper pockets, and why spend 4k to gain no hp and maybe 1 or 2 mpg? Nice article not picking on you, just sayin'
    5. Vanessa Wilson
      Vanessa Wilson
      No worries, I wasn't picking on you when I wrote the article, either.
    6. SCF/HAIC
      SCF/HAIC
      These days EFI doesn't cost that much more, prices have really come down in the 5+ years. By the time you factor in the total cost for a carb setup (hat and everything else), you're looking at about a $1000 difference between EFI and carb. And never need to rejet for altitude or track conditions, plus gain mileage so the total cost of ownership after about 20,000 miles is about $500 more give or take. I understand the appeal of carb setups, I really do... I've had plenty of "old iron" vehicles in my time. But from a standpoint of tuning, power, driveability and mileage, I'll take EFI. To each his own, makes the world go round. :)
      Vanessa Wilson likes this.
    7. My2003Terminator
      My2003Terminator
      Old school for cool. New school for everything else.
      Vanessa Wilson likes this.
    8. LT1 Guy
      LT1 Guy
      What about all the time you have to put in to learn to tune EFI?
    9. bigblockragtop
      bigblockragtop
      No way it is only 1k difference.
    10. vinces427bb
      vinces427bb
      well I would say I did not think that was a good $$$-difference either
      I have roughly $2000 in the fuel tank, lines, fittings, regulator, pressure gages, fuel pump, modified 750 CarbShop, fuel filters, and misc. items...
      I have seen some throttle body based EFI kits that are good for 600hp with 4-injectors, for about $2600 = that does not include the fuel system or the distributor needed to trigger it if you want to ECM to control the timing.
      costs go up for a MPI EFI set-up that adds 8-injectors, intake, fuel rails, harness, required distributor, etc...
      they also have some throttle body based EFI kits that are good for 800-1000hp with 8-injectors = these look interesting.
      there are also the DIY options from Megasquirt and others that are interesting, but I will most likely never drive this toy far enough to ever break even on the costs/fuel savings that may accrue..:blackalien:
      500-1500miles per year means I would have to drive the car until I was about 85years old:oops:
    11. 1968dodgecharger
      1968dodgecharger
      What kits are out there suitable for a roots blower EFI setup? I saw some setups that costs nearly 5k to 6k with injection hat, etc....or is the quick EZ EFI 2.0 setup for 2 grand suitable?
    12. vinces427bb
      vinces427bb
      what engine are you working with?
      old school hemi or newer?
      A, B, or RB engine?:blackalien:
    13. 1968dodgecharger
      1968dodgecharger
      I have a 'B' 383. Curious what would work injection wise up to 700HP for a roots setup. I gone through pricing and need a 1000cfm minimal carb probably opt for a 1250 QFX carb and that runs 1250 bucks.
    14. SCF/HAIC
      SCF/HAIC
      You start with a stock carb car. I'll start with a stock EFI car. Both of us add a supercharger. Besides the supercharger I'll be into it for larger injectors and a higher volume fuel pump, plus tuning software. How cheap is that carb setup looking now?
    15. vinces427bb
      vinces427bb
      in this scenario you would want to keep the EFI, as the car came with it
      in the carb car situation you will need to make sure what your plan is.
      for me it is still not economically viable yet.
      if the intended purpose of the car was other than a toy; then the plan could change:blackalien:
    16. 06BlownMagnum
      06BlownMagnum
      LOL its like Ford vs Chevy vs Mopar. We can all debate each one and in the end so much of it has to do with emotion and how each one makes us feel!
    17. SCF/HAIC
      SCF/HAIC
      You're right. We can each come up with scenarios when one is cheaper than the other, and it really does come down to if you prefer old school or new school.
    18. bigblockragtop
      bigblockragtop
      Sometimes it is what you already have. We are not all starting from scratch.
    19. boostedbuick
      boostedbuick
      Good point.
      You can have any two of these three: boosted, cheap, reliable. :)

      Not sure about that centrifugal force causing left cylinders to go lean Vanessa. Will have to ask my buddy that is an engineer for RCR. At this point I think we have to throw a yellow flag on this. :)

      The real key to fuel injection is the engine management system. On our GN we just put in a FAST system and have to say it is really impressive. If I could afford to switch to fuel injection that would be the starting point. $2000 right there. Then the new manifold, injectors, throttle body, sensors, and pretty soon you have $4000. If I was starting over this still might be the way to go as you can spend a lot on getting a blow through carb even close to right.

      If you are going roots type blower carburetors are much easier than blow through. Most any Holley or AFB carb works well. I even have a friend that has a Predator on top of a 671 blown 350 Buick.
      SCF/HAIC likes this.

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